Sebastian Lelio, the respected Argentinian-Chilean director, has a new prefix: Oscar-nominated. He received the nod for A Fantastic Woman, an exploration of identity and self-image. The movie stars trans-actress and singer Daniela Vega as Marina, who faces bigotry and suspicion after her older boyfriend dies. A Fantastic Woman is a complex exploration of the experiences of trans people, still hugely underrepresented in cinema and pop culture.

Lelio has always been drawn to the stories not told. He grew up in Chile during the dictatorship of Augusto Pinochet and the systematic suppression of political views, parties and artistic expression. “I studied journalism for a year, but I was dying to start making films,” he says. “Back then, the film schools were opening again after 20 years of dictatorship...I convinced them to let me go to one of the film schools opening back then.”

Lelio started making documentaries. One was based on unedited footage and material about the 9/11 terrorist attacks. He also shot a docu-series following the lives of Chilean families from diverse socio-economic backgrounds. When he started making feature films, he recreated the intimacy and realism of his documentaries. Gloria, about a 58-year-old divorcee, was a stunning and revealing portrait of mature womanhood. As with all Lelio’s work it flowed from his desire to pay attention to those whose lives are overlooked.

“Gloria was quite an organic process,” he says. “I grew up always listening to my mother and her friends. I would just sit and listen to their stories, and feel like they were amazing. But no-one was looking at them or trying to tell their stories. So Gloria really came from quite a close place. It also opened a door.”

Disobedience, to be released in Ireland this year, is an adaptation of Naomi Alderman’s novel of the same name. The story of a rabbi’s lesbian daughter who returns to her Orthodox community, it stars Rachel Weisz and Rachel McAdams. The film, as with Gloria and A Fantastic Woman, paints an intriguing portrait of complex women. Its power derives from Lelio’s desire to listen to women, and people from underrepresented communities. “My process is also very interested in the person playing the role... my films are always a little bit a documentary of the actress.”

Lelio’s collaboration with Daniela Vega on Gloria similarly came from listening to and understanding Vega and her experiences.

“I was very ignorant about trans issues,” Lelio admits. “I don’t live in Chile. I was quite detached from what was happening in Santiago. We met Daniela Vega while looking for a consultant. Over a year, the script started unfolding and being shaped by elements of her personality. Towards the end of the writing process I realised no-one else could play the lead role. I always wanted a trans actress to play the lead role. Discovering Daniela was an organic process.”

The film charts the microaggressions and small violences trans people face everyday. Vega’s character Marina is misgendered, called “a perversion,” accused of being a sex worker, subjected to humiliating strip searches and harassed by civilians, doctors and the police. Though these incidents were informed by Vega’s own experiences, Lelio is quick to note it’s not specifically based on her life.

“The film wasn’t biographical,” he clarifies. “There’s no scene that’s a complete creation of something that happened to her. It’s more about capturing the details, the little things, the texture that those microaggressions collectively create.”

Lelio says his decision to cast a trans actress wasn’t a political statement (“It felt like the right thing to do”). But he is also aware that cinema, along with the world, has progressed in its attitudes. To that end he doesn’t wish to dismiss past films that didn’t make the same casting decisions.

“My attitude is not that I want to blame films that haven’t cast trans actors in trans roles. I think that’s just cultural evolution,” he muses. “Back in the day, I remember seeing Boys Don’t Cry and being so moved, and thinking it was so important and necessary. But everything evolves. Now, casting trans roles is a more complex question. It’s clearly a moral decision.”

While it deals with heavy issues, A Fantastic Woman is also beautiful. It uses form and escapist sequences to explore empathy and resilience, contrasting the documentary feel of Marina’s everyday experiences with dreamlike cabaret performances that illustrate her ambition, joy and emotional release.

“It’s a complex animal, and operates in many different directions,” Lelio says. “The film plays with expectation and form and constantly poses the question, ‘What am I?’ I see it not just as an exploration of what is a woman, but as posing the question: what is a film? The idea of identity and elements in flux or that subvert our expectations are embedded in the film. So to make the movie with Daniela, who is a force of nature, was such a rewarding experience.”

A Fantastic Woman has now been nominated for Best Foreign Language Film. Lelio is of course thrilled. He’s equally moved at the prospect of more people seeing the film and exiting the theatre talking about the issues raised.

“We released it almost a year ago, so we’ve shared the film with so many people in so many countries. Seeing it so well received and understood has been fantastic. And the nomination is an extra beautiful gift that we take with great humbleness, but also great joy.”

After the Oscars, Lelio will go back to his production of the American remake of Gloria, to star Julianne Moore. “It’s like doing a cover of your own song with a different band. And it was wonderful to see this character come alive again through the incredible actress that is Julianne Moore.”
A Fantastic Woman is in cinemas from March 2.