HP interview: Ashley Cole

An enduring truism of football strategy is that the cornerstone of any great team is the defence. Back in the day, Germany had Beckenbauer. Later, Holland had Koeman, Italy had Baresi and France had Thuram, Desailly and Lizarazu. But undoubtedly one of the greatest defensive units of modern club football was the Dixon/Adams/Keown/Winterburn back four which so ably served Arsenal throughout the ’90s.

The formidable team presided over by George Graham may have had its critics (Fantasy Football presenter, Frank Skinner, upon being presented with an Arsenal team photo from the ’70s, which featured the squad lined across one of the Highbury goalmouths, wryly observed that, “it’s nice to see the club have stuck with the same formation ever since”), but there was no denying the side’s effectiveness, nor their impressive array of domestic and European titles.
Since the demise of that team and the advent of the Arsene Wenger era, Arsenal have set about restructuring their team and undertook the difficult task of replacing Lee Dixon, Tony Adams et al. Over the past few years, 22-year-old London native Ashley Cole has emerged as one of the cornerstones of the new regime. A tenacious full-back with a flair for attacking play (the legacy of his formative years as a striker), Cole’s consistently high level of performance has seen him graduate to the England international squad, where he currently provides Sven Goran-Eriksson with a sorely needed left-sided option ahead of this summer’s European Championships in Portugal.
I met up with Cole in the grounds of St. Alban’s City football club shortly after Arsenal’s recent clinching of the Premiership title. An affable, easy-going character who nonetheless conveys the intensity and single-mindedness common to all top-level athletes, Cole was in decidedly upbeat and talkative form throughout the interview.

PAUL NOLAN: Following Arsenal’s recent victory in the Premiership, do you think the club is now set to usurp Man Utd as the dominant force in English football?
ASHLEY COLE: Well, I would hope so. When you look back over the past few seasons, you see that we won the title a couple of years back, we should have won it last season and now, of course, we’ve finished first this year. So really, we should have won the Premiership three years on the trot. It’s looking good for us at the moment, but I think next season will be really crucial. Over the past decade or so, what’s tended to happen is that United have won for a few years, then there’s the odd season where another team manages to break the run, only for Man Utd to come back stronger than ever the following year.
So, until we’ve managed to win the title a couple of years in a row, I don’t think you can really say for certain that we’ve taken over, or that United’s dominance has ended, which a lot of people are suggesting at the moment. But certainly I think we’re in a better position to take over than any other club has been, for quite a while.
Was there a conscious decision taken in the club a couple of years back that there was an urgent need to replace the fabled old back four?
Not really. Lauren arrived a while back, but back then he was more of a right midfielder, and he was converted to right back to take Lee Dixon’s place. And I was bought into the set-up quite gradually, and eventually replaced Nigel Winterburn. I suppose there was a recognition that the boys were getting on - no disrespect to them, ’cos they were amazing servants to the club - but it wasn’t the case that there was an emergency meeting held and it was decided, “right, we’ve got to turf out the old guys!” (Laughs) When you’ve got a back four as talented as that, you want to hold on to them as long as possible, and then, when the time’s right, blood younger players. Obviously the back four has completely changed over the past couple of years, but it didn’t happen over night.
Arsene Wenger is one of the very few managers to arrive in English football over the past decade who seems to have the measure of Alex Ferguson. What do you think it is about him that gives him the edge over other coaches?
This is probably going to sound a bit odd, but it’s just how nice he is. The way he speaks to people is very, very good – he never rants and raves, and people like that. Players don’t respond to managers screaming and shouting. They prefer to have someone who talks very calmly and makes his point without throwing things around the place. At Arsenal, when the manager has something to say, he says it quietly and effectively. There’s no fuss. And people really, really respect him for that. It tends to make you want to do better actually, both for him and for the club. He’s shown a lot of faith in you, he treats you like an adult and because of that you end up with a huge amount of admiration for him. He has huge authority here; the atmosphere is great and everyone speaks very highly of him.
Is there a very strict code of discipline at the club? There’s been huge controversy in recent years concerning the off-the-field antics of players at Leicester and Leeds, and I couldn’t really imagine anything like that happening at Arsenal.
I think you’re absolutely right. There’s an attitude from the top down at the club that there is a definite way to conduct yourself off the field. And also, it goes back to what I was saying about the manager – because we all have such a huge amount of respect for him and what he’s accomplished here, nobody wants to do anything that’s going to cause trouble and bring the club into disrepute. To be honest, the way the club is set up, the opportunity probably isn’t going to arrive for anyone to get in trouble anyway. Aside from the fact that you need a huge amount of discipline if you’re going to compete at the top level, we don’t get involved in the kinds of things that normally lead to bust-ups and controversy.
For example, the manager has made the decision that we don’t go on tours, so that’s one thing we don’t have to worry about. As a result of that, no one’s going to get into trouble in a club at 3 o’clock in the morning in a foreign country, and I think that’s a quite a clever move on his part.
Whilst there’s been little controversy away from the pitch for Arsenal this season, there has been a certain amount on the field, with a significant number of players being sent off, including yourself. Was the indiscipline something the manager felt he had to sort out once and for all earlier this year?
Not really, to be honest. The thing is, I don’t think our players were really getting sent off that often. I mean, we were top of the Fair Play league, y’know? This season we’ve had maybe three or four players sent off – and I know certain people will say that for Premiership champions, that’s three or four too many – but we didn’t really think there was too much of a problem there. Apart from my own sending off, I don’t think there were too many serious incidents, in terms of players getting two yellow cards and silly things like that. Most of our sending offs have been straight reds, and perhaps other referees wouldn’t have sent off players for those tackles.
I don’t think we have to change anything; maybe we’ve just grown up. When you look at how Patrick (Viera) plays these days, if someone’s trying to wind him up he’ll just ignore it and keep playing his own game. I think more than anything, we’ve just matured as players. We didn’t have a meeting and say, ‘This has to stop’. If anything, the manager said, ‘Just keep playing the way you’re playing’. I mean, we’re a competitive team and I don’t think that’s something we need to apologise for.
But why do you think then that there’s a continuing perception that Arsenal are prone to indiscipline?
Well, obviously since Arsene Wenger’s arrived there’s been 54 sending-offs, or whatever the figure is. But I really think that if you look at half of those incidents, you could argue about whether or not the player in question really deserved a red card. I mean, some of those red cards were stupid and probably not the right decision, and that’s how we think about it. But we’ll never allow that to alter our game plan or stop us playing the way we want to play. We’re going to go into every tackle 100% and stand up to be counted when the need arises. That’s the way football is – it’s a hugely competitive game and you’ve got to be prepared to get stuck in.
You yourself were sent off against Leicester towards the end of last year, and Steve Howey made some disparaging remarks about you to the press in the aftermath of the game. Was that something you were annoyed about?
Yes, at the time I was really annoyed. I’m one of these players who thinks that if something happens on the field of play, then it should stay there and not become a big issue after the game is over. I’m not one of these guys who carries around a grudge about a bad tackle for a couple of years. So yeah, at the time I was a bit miffed, but it’s not something I’m particularly worried about. Now that it’s six months ago, I can be a bit more calm about the incident and say that Steve Howey was probably right in the comments he made. After a game, emotions are still running high and things get said in the heat of the moment because everyone’s so passionate about winning. But for me that whole thing is definitely over and done with.
Do you think that in recent times, the Premiership has effectively spilt into two divisions: yourselves, Man Utd and Chelsea at the top, and then a number of other teams competing in what is almost a separate league?
I suppose, at this precise moment, you’d have to say yes. But we don’t want to get complacent about it, because you have to be aware that the pendulum swings back and forth between the different clubs. And even now, I think Liverpool could make the leap into the top three next season, and Newcastle have been threatening to make the breakthrough for ages. They were very unfortunate in the mid-’90s, actually. They had United on the ropes on a couple of occasions but they just never seemed able to hold their nerve and finish it off.
So yeah, obviously we give some thought to who the main opposition is at the start of each season – but in a way it’s difficult for players to talk about because it can come back to haunt you. Like, if we start talking about United and Chelsea and really focusing on them, for a start, it makes us look arrogant, and secondly, these teams I’ve mentioned, like Liverpool and Newcastle, are definitely capable of making the step-up in the near future, and that should make the league a lot more competitive. So we’re aware of the competition, but we always have respect for the ability of the opposition, no matter who we play.
Ron Atkinson landed himself in hot water recently with racist comments following Chelsea’s exit from the European Cup. Have you yourself ever experienced racism in the game?
Just the once, when I travelled with the England team to Slovakia, and the supporters there – or so-called supporters – were having a go at me. But I’ve never encountered it on the field, I have to say. Maybe it was just an attitude amongst an older generation of football people, I don’t know. Amongst players of my own age, it wouldn’t be tolerated. And personally, I’ve been involved in campaigns like Kick Racism Out Of Football, and the response to that has been very good, in terms of the media coverage it’s generated and how people have got behind it. But like I say, it’s only ever happened to me once, and I don’t expect it’ll happen very often in the future. By and large, hopefully, the game has managed to move beyond that kind of thing.
These days, the tabloids would appear to take the view that playing for a top-ranking Premiership side means you’re fair game for an exposé. Do you find that you have to be very wary of where you socialise, who you hang out with, etc?
Yeah, you don’t want your private life splashed all over the papers, so you have to be careful in what you do and where you go, and behave in a responsible way. Because as I was saying earlier, if you get in trouble, it’s not just yourself you’re letting down, you’re bringing the worst kind of publicity to Arsenal, and that’s something that would be very much frowned upon in the club.
Do you think the level of intrusion into footballers’ lives is sometimes excessive?
Yeah, I do. But looking at it from their point of view, they’ve got to sell papers, and people want to read about celebrities, so it’s natural that they’re gonna focus on footballers, ’cos they tend to be fairly high profile these days. So I think that level of intrusion seems to be here to stay; it’s not gonna stop so, you just have get on with it. And that basically means that there are certain places you don’t go and certain things you don’t do.
Such as texting David Beckham?
(Laughs) No! Obviously, I can’t really comment on that, other than to say that Becks has the full support of his team-mates in the England side and that, personally, I can’t wait to play in the team with him this summer. He’s still the best right-winger – in fact probably one of the best players – in the world, and to us that’s all that really counts. Everything else is just a sideshow.
Speaking of the England side, Sven Goran-Eriksson recently held a press conference following the media speculation about his possible move to Chelsea, and he said that when you’re England manager, you’re expected not to have a private life, any consideration of professional advancement is verboten, and you need to be devoted to the cause seven days a week. You might as well be a monk!
I know, I know. I wouldn’t do it, personally. I think it’s an incredibly difficult job. Obviously, there’s a huge amount of interest from the press, the supporters always want the team to do well and there’s huge expectation with each tournament, but in a way, that’s just the start of it. I mean, there are so many league games these days too, there’s a greater chance of people getting injured and managers are reluctant to release players, because the club might have a tough game the following Saturday and what have you. So, it’s a really tough job with all sorts of different demands, and balancing them all must be very tricky. But I do think Sven Goran-Eriksson has done an excellent job. I mean, we qualified from a tough group, y’know? And we’ve got another tough one coming up!
Although matters have improved in recent years, the threat of hooliganism still seems to follow the England team wherever they travel. Is that ever a distraction for the team, and do you find it slightly embarrassing on occasion?
I suppose so. I mean, you’d have to stress that it is just a small group of people who always seem to cause trouble. The unfortunate thing is that all England supporters end up getting tarred with the same brush, when in reality it’s just a minority of idiots spoiling it for everyone else, and that’s really sad. But hopefully the security measures can get rid of that element. As for it being a distraction, I mean…I can’t say you ever find yourself standing on the sidelines, looking at fights in the stand (laughs). And it’s not really an issue at team meetings or at any stage of the preparation. There’s no self-defence classes or anything (laughs). Look, we’re footballers, and we go to play. That’s always the main focus at any given point.
In recent times, business moguls like Jack Walker, Silvio Berlusconi and Roman Abramovich have attained an increasing level of control on the game, and have tended to splash out huge money in transfer fees for big-name players. Has that made it more difficult for younger footballers to get a break at the bigger clubs?
I think younger players will always get their chance, but at the end of the day, managers have a job to do and they’ve got to win. It is maybe hard sometimes for managers to put a guy who’s just starting out in his career straight into the first team, especially if there are other options available on the transfer market. I mean, if it’s a choice between the younger player or a guy who’s been around the block and knows the score, I think most coaches are gonna go with the guy who has the experience. But I think at Arsenal we’ve proved that if you’re good enough, you’ll play. Over the past few years, I’ve got my chance, and then there are players like the goalkeeper, Stuart Taylor, and there are more younger footballers coming through now as well.
You went on loan to Crystal Palace.
That was a huge learning curve. I think that it makes you into a better person to go to the lower divisions, because being at Arsenal you get everything. Even something as basic as the kit; playing with a bigger club you can use as much you want, it doesn’t matter if you wreck a pair of shin-pads or whatever, whereas somewhere like Palace you’d have to really make the effort to keep your stuff together and not be wasteful, because they just don’t have the money to be buying new equipment every other week.
It toughens you up and makes you realise how fortunate you are to be playing at a big club. So something like that improves you as a person and as a player.
There’s been a lot of controversy in Ireland recently about Roy Keane’s return to the national side. You’ve played against him couple of times this season – is he the same player he was four or five years ago?
I don’t think he’s as good as he was – he is getting a little bit older now – but he’s still a great player. I mean, he’s not really one of those guys you want to be playing against every week. But I think if you take any player in his early to mid-thirties, it’s only natural that he’s not going to be the player he was four or five years before, because that’s when you’re at your peak. I actually think it’s become more difficult now for footballers to play at the top level until they’re in their mid-thirties, because the league has improved so much from even ten years ago. When you’re playing at a club like Man Utd, you’re playing two or three games a week throughout the season, and ten years ago you weren’t playing against Thierry Henry and Patrick Viera and Damien Duff on a regular basis.
But I think Ireland are lucky to have Keane back in the squad, because he’s still an incredible player. And hugely respected at Arsenal – and everywhere else, I’d expect. I remember a few years back, before we played Man Utd in a cup game, Tony Adams said, ‘When I look at their team from one to eleven, I honestly don’t think there’s any of their players I’d want in our side. Except Roy Keane’.That probably says a lot about how difficult he is to play against.
Finally, with regard to another Irish connection, did you play under Liam Brady in any of the Arsenal youth teams?
Not directly, no, but about the time I was being offered the YTS (Youth Training Scheme) contract, he was the one who recommended me to the management. I don’t think he actually saw me play too much, but based on what he did see he thought I should go on the YTS. I should thank him for that, actually, because that was a huge break for me. And I think Liam Brady has done a great job for the younger players here, so he deserves every credit for what he’s accomplished at Arsenal. Definitely.